goodMRKT Live
goodMRKT Live
Small Changes for a Big Impact | Karen Eller
Get ready to go green in our May podcast! We're celebrating Earth Day and all things sustainability with our special guest, Karen Eller. Tune in to hear some practical tips on how we can take better care of our planet, not just one day out of the year, but every single day. We'll be diving into the world of recycling and finding ways to make a positive impact on our home. So grab your reusable water bottle and get ready to join the movement towards a more sustainable future!
Allen County Department of Environmental Management
Welcome to Season Two of the good market podcast. I'm your host, Harry Cunningham. Each month, we hear from good people with great products, supporting exceptional causes and making incredible impacts on communities around the world. Join us now as we hear another good story about impact. It's happening right near you. Hey, everybody, thanks for joining us for this super exciting edition of good market live. For us. It's the April, the April issue, if you will, and our second anniversary podcast which perfectly aligns with Earth Day, which makes a lot of sense for us. So I have one of my good friends with us today, Karen eller, who in my opinion is certainly the person that I would go to for any recycling and composting tips. But Karen and I are going to talk all things Earth Day, Karen, welcome to the good market live podcast. Great having you. Thanks so much for having me, Harry. And Karen, your first podcast ever, which is super exciting for us.
Karen Eller:So exciting, scary. We'll just go with it.
Harry Cunningham:We're gonna be just fine. It's just it's a good conversation. No pun intended, or maybe pun fully intended. So, Karen, I want to I want to kind of jump right in. So Earth Day. conversations and discussions are not, in my opinion, something that's just happening around Earth Day, but something that should be happening all year. But one of the things that I discovered was Earth Day actually started in 1970, after a pretty tragic Earth event. And there was a senator that sort of started it. But tell me your take on it, like Earth Day has been around as long as both of you and I have been on the earth, although it's gotten much more prevalently talked about in the last couple decades, arguably, right? So what's your take on Earth Day, the importance of it versus everyday being Earth Day. Um,
Karen Eller:I guess in my world every day is Earth Day, because it's I often put when I posted on social media, like it's my favorite holiday because it is literally my favorite holiday. But I think that like other celebrations that we have, it's a punctuation a reminder, a time, once a year, where we think about we focus our energy on thinking about our planet, and resources and our role in all of that. So it's not a box to check. It's not a day you arrive at and you're like, ooh, celebration, and then it's over. It's more of a punctuation in how we think about our planet. And just a yearly reminder of who we are and why we're here and what we're doing.
Harry Cunningham:That's that's a great, great reference. It's sort of as you were saying that I was thinking a little bit about that. And it's sort of like, we have Mother's Day and we have Father's Day, which we should celebrate our moms and our dads every day, right? No different should we celebrate Mother Earth. So arguably, this is just the the adapted Mother's Day for the Earth. Right? Absolutely.
Karen Eller:I feel the same way about those holidays, too. I mean, I appreciate my mom every day, and I appreciate the Earth every day. So if we do a little extra on that day, then we can absolutely do that. And also, that should not diminish our gratitude on the other days.
Harry Cunningham:So speaking of your mom, I'm glad you mentioned that. Like I mentioned, Earth Day started before you and I were on the earth. But is this something you grew up with it? Or when at what point in your life? Did it sort of click in that you're like, Oh, I really need to be doing better? Oh,
Karen Eller:yeah, I think I don't know. It's interesting to see the evolution of, I think what I call efficiency, and I think that there's been a generational shift. So in the past, we tended to waste less because we had less and so it was more of a a way to make sure that we were using the most of what we have. So glass jars did not go disposed of because that was a good container. We didn't have as much single use stuff as we have these days. And so I grew up in a family where my mom used to drive our recycling, ooh, clear across town to the recycling centers and collected in the car and we load it all up. And we do it once a week. There was no curbside. There was none of that. But I mean, I grew up with that. And so that's, I think that's all I've ever known. We composted, we gardened, we use the compost in our garden, it all sort of was just a part of our daily interface with the world. So this it's not a big leap that it's important to me now.
Harry Cunningham:So when you think about like, that's something you grew up with, so naturally, it's probably easier for you. If there's somebody out there that's never recycled, right? And they're likely there are people that have never done recycling never done. I've never composted, although we compost a good market now. What's the easiest place to start? What's the simplest place to start for somebody that just says hate, like, I missed out on the last 35 years? I want to start something now. What should they do?
Karen Eller:You know, that's a really good question. And I was thinking about the kinds of obstacles that get in the way of people making decisions around sustainability or having those choices and I came up with like three main obstacles that people run into One, they're confused, they don't know where to start. They don't know like the first step to take, which we could obviously get to to answer your question to maybe they're just kind of apathetic or don't really understand that there's any impact. So it's like, it's just a plastic bottle, it doesn't matter, what difference does it make, you know, there's no sort of connection to the bigger picture on this one action that they can take. And so there, that's an obstacle. And the third one is sort of overwhelmed. It's like, ah, like, there's so many different things I could do I just don't even know where to start, or like, I don't even know what the right answer is. Because some of these things feel really confusing. And so I think that identifying your obstacle to engaging in the process might help you with determining what that next step might be for you. So I mean, the ones that I bring up are pretty cliche, because the people talk about them all the time. But so it's like, bring your water bottle or bring your coffee mug or heavier, you know, bring your bags to the grocery store. The problem is that you won't do it unless you create a system that you will actually use. So if you have a bag that doesn't fit in your purse, are you going to have it when you're at the store? Probably not. I found I mean, Product Marketing, if you will, I don't care bag, who makes the best bag and it fits down, I have a little pocket in my purse, it is strong, it holds 50 pounds worth of stuff, it's big, I can pretty much stuff everything into it. And it's with me all the time. And so this is the thing that you want to do is the thing that you will do, if that makes great
Harry Cunningham:sense. Yeah, I think that totally makes sense. Which is something you know, as easy. As you mentioned, water bottles, it's as easy as water bottles. But on that water bottle note, you told me about something recently that I didn't know with regards to the cap on the water bottle, which is something that everybody do, I think I do. I think Water Bottle Recycling is pretty much, much more prevalent now than it was even just a few years ago. But that one little thing can make a difference. Can you talk about that a little bit? Yeah,
Karen Eller:I mean, I think that gets into the confusion part, right? Like the I don't like we were told one thing, and now it's different. And so it's true. Like, It's hard even for me, like I try to stay really up to date on not just what's happening globally, but like what is happening in my own community and how we how we process our recycling. And so I think that one of the things to keep in mind to your example, we used to have to throw the caps away. So you took the cap off, or you put the bottle in, you threw the cap away, you threw it all in or you know, it's all plastic, you know, let God decide. But now, they make the caps the same plastic type as the bottles. And so now the advice that I would give is to put the bottle cap back on the bottle, and put that in your recycling because and it's this is how we get through some of the confusion around recycling. It's all going through a recycling system. And these teeny parts will fall through and they won't get recycled, they just end up on the floor and they get swept away. And that's that if you put that cap, that's the same plastic type as the bottle together, those both will make it through the whole process together.
Harry Cunningham:And what about the label and I know a lot more labels are you know, they're done a lot of different ways now, but what about the label, peel the label off, leave label on doesn't label just
Karen Eller:stays on it, it will stay, the label stays on. And that's the same with you know, tin cans for your soup, you can keep the labels on I take them off because it's paper and you can recycle the paper. So if you leave it on the can, it's probably not going to get recycled. But if you take it off, I put it with my paper recycling and but yeah, I think that simplicity is best when it comes to recycling.
Harry Cunningham:Yeah, interesting. And the I know in Fort Wayne, our recycling is a little bit different than in other parts of the country too. So I'm going to kind of be able to speak so if somebody's listening in New York or somebody's listening in California or somebody's listening in Fort Wayne, obviously, they can adapt to whatever is local for them. Absolutely like at home. And hopefully we're doing this the right way all of our recycling goes in one bin. And it gets picked up, right, wrong or indifferent.
Karen Eller:That isn't that that's how ours works out. It used to be very different, which is another thing you can see the shifts that happen as we as we upgrade and move along. I think that when it comes to recycling, and this is just a universal fact for for at all is that we want things to recycle. And so we put them in the bin. But if you don't know that it actually recycles, it probably shouldn't go in your recycling bin. Again, you start thinking about this process no matter where what state you're in, you're going to have some sort of processing equipment. So if you're putting something like you're like, Oh look a wire hanger that's metal, it goes in my recycling. It does not plastic cans do not anything that's going to mess up the process of the manufacturing that goes into it is actually causing more harm than good. Like don't throw your garden hose in there. Don't throw string and like anything that can get tangled. You don't want to be in the recycling and you just should just forget about those
Harry Cunningham:like plastic clamshell containers that you get like a piece of pie from fresh market and what about
Karen Eller:we get into that tricky question. And I will say they, you know, because these containers are manufactured for, like, you know wide distribution, it's not specific to our recycling stream. So just because it has a number on it, you can put it in your recycling, it doesn't mean it's necessarily gonna get recycled. So Styrofoam is a big, big thing we can talk about. You know, one of the things I've learned sitting in on recycling conventions, because that is how I spend time because I love this stuff. I learned recently that black plastic does not recycle, not because it's not recyclable, but because the sensors can't read the number on the black. And so if you've got a takeout container that's got a black bottom, odds are more than likely it's going to end up in the garbage, I try to have other ways to repurpose those kinds of containers. But the general rule of thumb, I'm holding up a one to five, a funny little alien sign. The one two fives are the ones that recycle primarily in our community, we can put one through seven in there, but those are the most prevalent plastics that we have, those are the most like easily to use again. And so and you may remember the four that's out there, those are your your plastic bags. So those can recycle but not in your bed. You have to take this mattress to grocery store.
Harry Cunningham:You mentioned a word in there that like gave me a little bit of tighten up Styrofoam, right, and Styrofoam was the it material, right? It was like everything. And now when I get something in styrofoam, I'm always like, seriously, you haven't figured this out like styrofoam is a rough one. And an arguably there are certainly things that Styrofoam has made our world better by being in it. But certainly food containers not one of them. Like what what's your take on like companies that are still using Styrofoam and it's two things one is the cup, right? And I'll talk about one of them. I won't mention their name, but I'll talk about one of them in a minute. But one is the cup because it keeps things cold or hot. And the other is the food container right what's like, what's advice for those companies that haven't figured that out yet?
Karen Eller:I actually my advice is for the people who populate those establishments and putting on some peer pressure because I feel like that's our that's our only leverage point with that the reason Styrofoam is is popular is because it's inexpensive. So when you're doing a price comparison of a Styrofoam takeout container versus either a compostable one or a plastic one, there's a price differential. So there's a reason why companies do it. Like it makes sense to them, you know dollars and cents to them. The problem is that you know, it never goes away like styrofoam doesn't recycle here it does have a recycled number on the back of it but any Styrofoam you put in your recycling here in Fort Wayne, Indiana is going to get put in the trash because we don't have the facilities to recycle it so you know it's the peer pressure from customers is where companies might start to change those actions. If you want to have accountability and I'm still I've not developed the right methodology for me to follow for this but you can bring a clean container and take your own leftovers home and your own but that doesn't help you with like takeout orders. Like you're ordering from you know something and it just comes home and Styrofoam. There are plenty of reasons health reasons to not put especially worm food and Styrofoam and there are lots of health reasons to not have Styrofoam and in our environment unnecessarily so and
Harry Cunningham:the fact that when you open it up and the French fries have melted the styrofoam can't be a great thing. Right. So those fumes have gone in the mic to your french fries, right? It's like it's funny, I was at a drive thru recently. And I won't share their name but they it's a place that is focused on beverages, consumable beverages that might have come from fruits and you know, turned into smoother beverages, right? When you go through the drive thru, you get a plastic recyclable cup. When you go inside, you get a Styrofoam cup. And as a business owner myself, I know there's no economies of scale and having two different cups. So I've had a hard time trying to figure out what's the reason behind it. Why do you get x inside and why outside? But it's a to your point. Maybe just for for anybody to think about that. If you end up in one of those places. Just say hey, give me the one that's recyclable instead. I'm okay. I know that's your standard, but I'm okay with the other one. Right?
Karen Eller:Absolutely. And I hate to say say this, but it's like we have a lot of choices. So if there's a company that matches your values better than another one, I mean, I don't expect everyone to care about this. Like I do, but I just you know you can populate the restaurants that are following those values. When we're ordering takeout. I actually think about whether the restaurant I'm ordering from has compostable takeout materials, as opposed to Styrofoam because I don't want to eat out of Styrofoam. I will not drink coffee out of Styrofoam. It really freaks me out.
Harry Cunningham:And we don't get good market we serve recycled and recyclable cups. So we're doing doing all right. Love it. Um, so on that note about compostable or compostable or however, which whichever way you'd like to say it composting, composting, the compostability of materials is much, much more prevalent now. Right shocking things that are compostable now that weren't, like, how fast do you see that changing? And I've certainly noticed it. I've been closer to it for the last two years than likely the last, you know, 30 years prior, but much more plant based materials being used for that what's happening with
Karen Eller:that? Great question. I think that I mean, I've seen even in our own community, I've been so thrilled to see, we don't have citywide composting, which is something I've had in multiple cities that I've lived in. And I've wondered where third Bin was. But we do have some private companies that have popped up in Fort Wayne the last couple of years, they're doing a phenomenal job promoting and talking about the importance of composting, and it's huge, partly because so much of what we throw away is organic material that if it goes into the landfill, it's just going to build up methane gases and methane gases are contributing to climate change right now. And so, you know, all those organic things are old tomatoes, banana peels, whatever it happens to be, those can just be going straight back into the ground, and also creating lovely soil that we can use to plant other things, we need these rich soils. So there's so many great benefits to composting. And it's great to see some businesses here that are really taking that on both from an education standpoint, and from an accessibility standpoint. So we composted in our backyard growing up because we had a big field back there, and nobody was bothered by it. But if you have neighbors, right nearby, they may not want you to have a compost bin, because they think it smells or whatever. But I think that there is a shift toward people thinking about it. But I do think we have a ways to go. Because when you talk about those habits that you establish, even walking the compost out to our own compost bin, or like collecting it for someone to get it, it adds, you know, people are busy, they are trying to get by in the world and it feels like something extra.
Harry Cunningham:So question for you on that you mentioned like tomatoes and benas things going in the landfill? What's the difference? In me sending my bananas to a landfill? versus me putting my bananas in a compost bin? Oh, it's it's huge. How does it how can you like how if somebody that doesn't understand composting, totally never done it before. Okay, just thinks I throw stuff away and goes, how does it do better in a compost bin, a banana peel, for example, then it would do in a landfill because isn't dirt dirt?
Karen Eller:Right? You think right. And what what they found is that these are landfills, which is the primary method of disposal here in Indiana, we have some of the lowest they call tipping rates. So it is cheaper to throw things in a landfill here than to do pretty much anything else that that is just the way it is statewide here. But they are large tombs of our stuff. And so what happens is, everything gets kind of sealed into these landfill, it's not like they're continually like turned over, it's just like a big mound. And so in order for something to break down, it has to be in exposed to air and there has to be some process that goes on, you know, to microbes to be able to get to it, that kind of thing. But if things aren't getting turned over and expose the air spores to water, they're just gonna stay there. I mean, they're they could be an urban myth, I should have looked this up. But they're like reports of finding heads of lettuce that were like 20 years old, that were just basically frozen in time in a landfill because nothing gets to him. So it's a very different experience with my compost bin, I mean, we have to just because we have a family and we're constantly cutting things up and adding it to, but it takes us almost a full year to fill up one of our compost bins that's outside and we're turning it over and using we add brown matter there's green, you know, the wet matter and the brown matter. And you know, there are mixie we don't do any of that we we just let it be with I turn it every once in a while. But the reality is that a breaks down is very full Ben goes from very full down to like practically nothing at the bottom, but it has this collection of really fine, beautiful soil that we can then use in our very clay soils that we have around our house right now. And it's very nutrient rich. Again, we talked about the methane earlier that you're because you're constantly churning it, those methane gases aren't building up your you know, like none of those things happening. Compost is so beautiful. It's like what we're what what the Earth does on its own. It's its own process, like it's our own way of existing on this planet is what the Earth does is compost. It's organic material.
Harry Cunningham:Interesting, and we won't dig too much into this topic today. But I've even heard the newest thing with composting is human composting, which is actually allowing you to become part of the earth again, right, which is arguably I mean, again, not not so much for today, but arguably a much more sustainable way for us to continue doing things even after Oregon,
Karen Eller:right? It's so beautiful, they have so many beautiful ways to engage. And I would love to talk more about that I have a deep passion for green and conservation burial. And we can just, we can go just go back to the dirt. It's very, very simple.
Harry Cunningham:So how do your kids embrace composting and recycling? Again, like you were brought up that way your kids have been brought up, even with arguably a little bit more focus on it with more learning behind it that you What do you think for our kids generation? How do you think this will become Do you think it'd be more just what everybody does? Because it's what we do? Do you think they're starting to? Is it impacting that generation yet?
Karen Eller:Hmm, good question.
Harry Cunningham:Are they like, Bom? Do I really have to go data? Are they just doing it with it? I
Karen Eller:mean, they they do it, I think that they, they run into their own obstacles that I talked about, right, like they have their own confusion. I mean, we have a lot of recycling systems in my house right now. Because it's not just about the recycling. I mean, it's before you even get to recycling, it's reduce, and then reuse. And the last option is recycle. So it's like, how do we not have this in our house in the first place? If it's here? Does it have another value as something else? And if not, now, how do we dispose of it in a way that has the least amount of impact? And so my kids aren't quite old enough, they, we haven't quite assign them like the duty of taking out the compost needs to happen faster. I still do. We get a lot of compost at our house. But I mean, they're, they are still learning their way even around my systems. And I think again, they also have the obstacle of like, not seeing how much and adults are the same way how much this fits into the bigger picture. I mean, just just for a fun fact, 18 billion pounds of plastic waste flows into the ocean every year from coastal regions. I mean, we have islands the size of Texas floating around in our oceans that are completely based in plastic. I mean, we have a real plastic problem real close. And so here's an exam. Okay, so how do my kids participate, they know that we don't do plastic water bottles at our house. So I have a couple of years ago, just set a goal for myself of only using five water bottles a year. And it was like, Okay, it's not nothing. So if I'm stranded somewhere, and I'm parched, and like this is the odd I don't have my water valid, because the only backup right I can have one of my five but my kids know that we bring our water bottles and that, like if there's a water fountain and we don't ever water we use that. And so if we're going to be home in 15 minutes, we don't need to have that water bottle. You know, it's so it's like, yeah, how do we so I think that's one way that they adapt to my values of not using plastic. So purposely, you know, we don't do you really need it. That's the key. You really need
Harry Cunningham:it. Yeah, I love that. And I know shameless plug for good market, we don't sell water in plastic water bottles, we use open water, the brand that we carry is open water and it's actually in an aluminum can, which is perpetually recyclable, I learned we were doing a different kind of water that I thought was great and wasn't and actually found out that we went from 97% recyclable to 100% recyclable when we switch to this open water brand that comes in and aluminum cans and like them. PS I think the water tastes great. And I know there's this whole aversion to aluminum cans as it changes the taste of above. And I think we'll leave that to the soda drinkers of the world but our water I'm super proud of the fact that the water that we sell the the sparkling waters and glass so that you know, again recyclable and I think that's that goal of five water bottles, while arguably sounds extreme over 365 days, or 52 weeks, so you get one plastic bottle every 10 weeks is probably attainable. Like yeah, I think that's a great challenge that you've taken on yourself that we could you know, give to people that are listening could you go the next 52 weeks and just do five plastic bottles?
Karen Eller:I have another yes and I have no judgment people worry that I'm judging them all the time not I just like I'm really competitive with myself and so like I tried to think about how I'm like how close can we get our household to zero waste? You know, like what else could we be doing? We have a trade setup with ag normally don't live next door but like I found someone who needed my egg carton so this is a cool I when I get a collection of egg cartons, my neighbor comes to get them and brings me eggs from their chickens and so I trade my egg cartons for a carton, you know, like a carton of eggs. So there's like a neighborhood swap thing going on. And just
Harry Cunningham:I'm assuming you're using the paper egg cartons, right? Well, it's
Karen Eller:switched. So there are some that are made out of plastic and this is we could do a whole deep dive I made a list of things that people think might be recyclable, but aren't those paperboard a cartons are not actually recyclable? Oh really better than Styrofoam. Definitely compostable but they're making such a poor that like a used pulp of paper that that that can't be used anymore. So the fact that my neighbor can use them for eggs again, is a better use for those paperboard egg cartons. Again, we get the paperboard over the styrofoam if you're gonna throw away either way, but but just the challenge part of it for me, I was reading that. In the United States, shoppers use almost one plastic bag per resident per day. And in Denmark, shoppers use an average of four plastic bags a year. And so it's that same thing. It's I'm like, Oh, look, I did this with water bottles, not realizing that Denmark was kind of doing the same thing with their shopping bags. But that's another thing. It's just like, if we all challenge ourselves to just reduce in whatever way that looks like. It doesn't have to be five water bottles a year that may not like I don't drink fizzy. Well, I don't drink things. So it's not a sacrifice for me. But what is that one thing that you could just do less of? Like you have less in your in your footprint?
Harry Cunningham:What are some of the other I heard you say you made a list? What are some of the other thought we could recycle but actually can't or shouldn't? Once? Oh my gosh,
Karen Eller:I just learned this one recently, you know, the receipts that you get everywhere on that paper? Yes, seeds are not recyclable. Yeah, that thermal paper is not good for you. You don't want to handle it with lotion because you get the chemicals in like they actually go in through your skin. So anyway, that's a whole nother story. But it's
Harry Cunningham:a good reason, though. On that note, like, have your receipt emailed to you. Yes.
Karen Eller:Don't take your receipt. Oh my gosh, that was so easy. Just don't take it easy. You're at the gas station, don't take a receipt, you know, if especially if we're not going to look at it. I mean, take it if you need it for your expenses or whatever, but like, don't take it if you don't need it. So receipts was a big one for me. I always put them in my paper recycling. I was like, Oh, no Styrofoam. Again, here, Indiana does not recycle do not put Styrofoam in there. There are some one of the great things about recycling in Indiana. A lot of people are like, oh, it just goes off to China and it gets thrown away there. It's not doesn't work. I could be delusional, but I really believe in the manufacturing. And we are in the epicenter of being able to use products that we need and manufacturing here in this state. So for a great example, we've got fiberglass plants right here in Indiana, we get our glass from Michigan. Why? Because they prioritize glass recycling. And they do it burst. So they have a really clean glass product. So you know, we recycled at least in Fort Wayne, the glasses last and so ours gets downgraded into concrete, which is better than throwing it away all together. But we are in a place in the Midwest that uses materials. And so there is we talk about Styrofoam, those Styrofoam blocks, there are companies here that need your styrofoam blocks. I don't expect anyone to drive them out or mail them out or whatever that is, but I'm just saying that there is a place here in Indiana that would take your styrofoam blocks and recycle them. If you were to choose to get them out there. They're getting used. They're not getting shipped to you know, like, yeah, we're using them here as an industry
Harry Cunningham:of that. What's something you can compost there was something that I learned about we were able to compost and we do it now that I was surprised by what's something that you can compost that maybe people didn't realize, like the food part particles, I think are easy ones, right? Like everybody gets that. But what is one something? The one I'll tell you the one that we found out about that we didn't know was our coffee filters. Oh, yeah, we use a lot of coffee filters. But we could actually. And our partner we use ground down locally, they help us with our composting a good market and they were the ones that was like, Hey, by the way, you can take the whole thing and just dump it right in. We're good.
Karen Eller:Well, this I love this conversation because I just I started teaching in an enrichment program at school for elementary school aged kids. And so I'm like, How can I distill this down into like, just the really simple way for kindergarteners to understand this, and we came up with is it brown? Or is it from nature? Those are the things you can compost so paper towels, they're not necessarily Brown, but paper towels can get composted napkins, paper napkins can get composted, like any of those paper products, as soon as it starts getting altered in some way. So think of paper plates with like that wax coating, no good, no more. So it's like a lot of times those like coffee filters, those are brown, those go in your compost, you know. So papers that are brown, you can recycle your white paper, we we we, I mean compost it, but we tend to prioritize recycling over compost just to not fill up our bin. I will say that the composting companies can handle more organic matter than possibly your backyard compost so we don't put any meat or dairy into our home compost. But larger facilities are able to handle that that kind of material. So it kind of depends on where you're composting.
Harry Cunningham:Super cool. One of the just since it's Earth Day two, I wanted to talk a little bit about planting as well. So you talked about the great dirt that comes from composting but when you think about planting too, and we just added a new line called with a wild that's all organic product and it's made on an earthworm farm in California, in my opinion, like super cool that To actually even planting things and the idea behind organic planting, but I know there's some some challenges with organic and I put that in quotes, right, what really isn't what really isn't. But the idea that you can actually use these things is much more, perhaps the way we should be growing, right and keeping keeping pesticides out. But any thoughts on that kind of organic growth and using composting material to grow better?
Karen Eller:I think again, it depends on people in their space, I was just listening to this fascinating article on vertical gardens on NPR yesterday, and how much more efficient it is from a water use standpoint. So not everyone is going to have the time or inclination or space to be gardening in their own space. But when I think about gardening, I think about in planting, I think about how do we reduce our carbon footprint of for how far things are traveling. So beyond the organic, which is great, and the using of like, amazing, rich soils that we get from compost, what our local farmers doing, because they are really tuned in to their crop yields. And they are maybe unable to apply for the organic certification, but are doing really great things on their farms that maybe don't meet the highest level, but they're not using pesticides there, there are fees that they have to pay in order to be part of it. And this was something I learned just going to the farmers market was like, Oh, just because it's not labeled organic doesn't mean that that farmer isn't practicing, you know, an organic process here. So it's really worth going to the farmers markets and talking to talking to the farmers getting a sense of where they are, you can often go out to their farms. And then not only are you using please food from places that are very close to your reducing that you're also stimulating your local economy and supporting people that are right there in your backyard.
Harry Cunningham:I love that. No, I think one of the things that I've seen just in the two, two and a half ish years that we've been working a good market is that idea behind organic production and sustainable production. Just in two years time is far more prevalent than it was pre pandemic. And I don't know if like something happened while we were all staying in our homes for that period. But I see so much more that's organic, stable, but much like recycling perhaps I think, to your point, you'd need to stay close to it. You need to learn and ask the questions and truly understand because what people can and can't do with regards to that being able to say their organic, maybe isn't always the end all maybe there are people like you said that are doing great things, but they haven't either been able to apply or have have been afforded, you know, had the money to do whatever might reason. So I think that's interesting asking those questions. And I would argue even, you know, for those of us that are buying fashion goods, looking for people that are doing sustainable production is really, really paramount to this idea of reducing your carbon footprint, whether it's how things are shipped, or how things are produced, or whatever it is, I met a guy I don't know, I may have shared the story with you, I met a guy when we were down in Atlanta, that is a soap manufacturer. And it's called the handmade soap company. We don't carry them at good market right now. We may at some point, but they actually were creating their factory. And the first plan was that they would build this big fancy new factory, but the owner said no, I'm not going to do that. I'm going to repurpose a building that had been closed and vacant for a long time. It's actually an old linen factory, down by a river in Ireland, and he actually uses the power of the river to power the building. Like that's really making the true impact. And yes, it's going to cost a little bit more. But my personal goal is that, you know, 10 years from now, things that are organic or sustainable or recycled, shouldn't cost more it should be the reason that we do it is because it's the right thing to do not because it's the cheapest thing to do.
Karen Eller:Yeah, it's it's we have a we have a ways to get there. But I love the innovation that I see all over the place. And I think that to all the people who might be feeling overwhelmed about even knowing how to make the first right step is just making a step that feels good to you and feeling really good about it not being shamed, feeling shame of all the things that you haven't been able to done or do or don't think that it makes a difference. I think that every one of us making a more conscious decision about what we're buying. I mean, one of the things that I love, one of the lines that I love in your store is the one with the with the raw edges, the fabric of the raw edges, so they don't have the fabric waist, and it's like, if we don't have the waist of the first place, then we'd have to figure out what to do with it. So like there's an efficiency there. That's so beautiful. And I think that the Earth itself is is so efficient in how it operates. And we got in there we kind of tinkered and made plastic and it seemed awesome. But I do worry about the kids and I worried about the future that we'll have because I mean I'm not sure many people know this, but most of the plastic that's been created in the world has been since 2000. So it's it's a needed thing and we Our it doesn't go away, it breaks down into tiny, tiny, tiny pieces. And it ends up at the bottom of the oceans and then the like micro organisms eat it, and then fish eat it, and then we eat them. And now there is not a place on earth where they are not finding microplastics, from the deepest trenches of the ocean to the Hill, Himalayan mountains, it's coming off your couches and your bedding, it's there. We're breathing them in all the time. And I'm not trying to be alarmist about it. It's just what is in the back of my mind when I'm thinking about what's important to me. Plastic is not like I don't, I don't want it. So like, How can I contribute to this knowing that I can't change the tide of the, you know, the plastic industry, I can just make choices around those things where I can when I can,
Harry Cunningham:I think that's key too, right? I don't think that anybody should be saying, well, I can't do it, I'm not going to make a difference when actually your choice. Paired with my choice paired with 10. More people's choices, does start to make an impact. So it is kind of this idea that if you can make the choice, you don't have to be judgmental. If somebody wants to use a Styrofoam cup, so be it that's fine, but I'm not going to use one right. I think that's a great point. So any big plans for Earth Day this year, you do have a new challenge, you're gonna give yourself as you as you get ready to kick off the next year. I know like the the five water bottle one is a great one. Anything somebody should think about if they wanted to get started this year, they could take it on as their own challenge.
Karen Eller:Good question. I feel like the easiest place to start is at the grocery store. So my next challenge was once I got down the habit of bringing in my bag, which maybe that's your challenge, maybe your bag is maybe your challenge to yourself, this birthday is like I'm going to develop a system so that my bags are with me. And it might mean that you put them back in your car and you're like, Okay, I got them in the car, I kept forgetting I keep forgetting to bring them into the store like, okay, how am I going to remember to bring them into the store? Like do I put a post it note there? You know, like, how do I remember this? So figuring out whatever that process is for you. Now that I've got the bag thing down, I've started thinking about how my produce comes in, you know, it's winter. So I'm not frequenting farmer's markets for my produce as much, but it's like okay, do I buy the computer, the cucumbers that are wrapped in plastic? Or do I buy the ones that are just free flow, I more often than I'm trying to focus on the ones that don't have the extra plastic. i My husband is very particular about meat and making sure that like salmonella is not getting around our house. I still don't put my meat I will have another bag for my like chicken that I might put it in. But I will wash it when I get home. So I'm not pulling an extra plastic bag. I don't put any of my produce in plastic bags.
Harry Cunningham:Like me. I'm paranoid. I'm salmonella paranoid. So
Karen Eller:you know if that's your thing, maybe you allot yourself a plastic bag for your meat. But do your bananas need
Harry Cunningham:to be the plus I don't bag my bananas?
Karen Eller:Are you afraid they're gonna run away? Why? Anyway, that whatever you need to do, but I just think about the grocery store in ways that you can just like chip chip away at some of those some of those superfluous plastics that we just are part of our culture. But do they need to be?
Harry Cunningham:Yeah, I think one of the things you mentioned the grocery store that I would love to see is what if we could bring our own container to the olive bar? Like we're we're suckers for the olive bar, right? But there's always those plastic containers at the Olive bar. Like, what if I could just bring my own container, put my olives in it or my own peanut butter if I'm grinding fresh peanut butter, almond butter, like you can
Karen Eller:do that. At the coop, they have peanut butter grinding, and they've got honey there that you can collect. Right in your own thing. Yeah, yeah, in your own containers. And so that's again, it's like, Okay, do I care about this enough to shift where I'm grocery shopping to make these changes happen? You know, there's a lot to think about. And again, I try to talk it think about in a way that it's not overwhelming for folks to do, because whatever it is that you choose, it's out there and like you can choose whatever path makes sense for you and your family. I will say that our Allen County Department of Environmental Resources, or environmental management has a great program and they are such an ally. They just had a discussion last night at a public library about how recycling works. So for all of our local listeners, I email them all the time and ask them because people email me and if I don't have the answer, I want to get the right question answered in the appropriate way. So I want to get good information out and they also have something called waste watchers, which you can look up how to dispose of things. Reduce Reuse, here locally in our community.
Harry Cunningham:That's great waste watchers. Very cool. Yeah, we'll put that in the show notes too. So that people in case they don't remember they can check back then fantastic
Karen Eller:resource you can recycle your light bulbs in your batteries and all these harder they recycle things they show you where to do it.
Harry Cunningham:I think one of the one of the ones that stumps me all the time is what do I do? Speaking of batteries with all the old electronics like what am I really going to do with a laptop or a phone and you know, especially our friend with the with the fruit as their logo does such a nice job of telling you why you need a new one every year. And you don't obviously but what do you do? Like there's something to be said Out of out there too. So it's really literally every touch point in your life, there's probably something you could do that makes a difference, right?
Karen Eller:Yeah. And I think probably the easiest thing is what I and I think, probably my focus for this Earth Day is going to be, do I need that? You know? Do we need it? Do we need? Yeah, all the things? And I think the answer for me is probably less that I probably could use a lot less. That's whether it's clothing, electronics, you know, all of it. So I think for me, that's gonna be my personal meditation.
Harry Cunningham:Good stuff. One last question before we go. And I might have given you a little heads up on this, but I'm not sure if I did. So what you know, we get the joy of telling stories. And I'm super excited about this one that you and I have told today, and hopefully it will inspire someone to just make a little bit of a change. But when you when you think about the Karen eller story, and somebody gets to tell that later in life later in your life after your life, who would you pick to tell your story? And why would you pick them?
Karen Eller:You know, you did tell me this, and I think I ignored it because I was like, wow, that's a really? Um, oh, gosh. Yeah, I don't really have a great answer that I think of all the people who have influenced my life. And you know, I do a lot of research and just tinkering around with this. But in terms of the science, but one of the people who really brought home this content, but from a more artistic standpoint was Barbara Kingsolver. And so I would love a like a novel written by Barbara Kingsolver, that kind of like woven the threads of my life in a more fiction sort of way. And that, to me, that would be really beautiful, because I've always enjoyed her books and how she can crossover between fiction and nonfiction and like, tell a story that's still really relevant. But it's also interesting to listen
Harry Cunningham:to. Very cool look. Great answer, Karen. Thanks for taking the time. I appreciate it super valuable conversation and likely one that we could have several times over, not just for Earth Day, but literally for every day. So I appreciate you taking the time today to talk with me and give us some tips on all of the above. But you know if anybody has anything else that they want to know, certainly wastewaters is the place to go. But Karen, it's been great having conversation with you today. Thank you so much.
Karen Eller:This has been so fun. The time went so fast. Good, good.
Harry Cunningham:We'll talk soon. Thank you. Thank you for joining us for this episode of the good market podcast. A new episode will drop the second Tuesday of each month. So make sure you subscribe wherever you're listening. Give us a like a follow and a share. And please leave a review so that we can reach even more people and grow even more good. Tune in next time to hear more stories from good people with great products supporting exceptional causes. We'll see you next month.
